It’s a sad day when one great American cyclist, the first to win the Tour de France, goes into a courtroom to testify against the current Tour de France champion. I take no pleasure or happiness in writing this post. For me, this is one of the blackest moments in the history of professional cycling in the United States.
Greg LeMond has started to testify at the Floyd Landis hearings. After answering some routine questions, LeMond spoke of his conversation in August with Landis where he encouraged Floyd, if he had doped, to come clean. During the phone call, LeMond told Landis a very personal story as a way of illustrating what keeping a secret can do to a person. Up to that point, he says he didn’t tell that story to very many people.
The story, which LeMond told to a quiet courtroom, where his wife is present, is that as a boy, he was sexually abused. For years, LeMond kept the secret to himself (and perhaps a few close family members), and he says it almost destroyed him. As far as I know, this is the first time LeMond has spoken about this matter publicly.
I’m sorry to hear about this, and sorry to see LeMond on a witness stand talking about what must be a very difficult subject. It’s sad, to a degree that I can’t even begin to fathom.
During his conversation with Floyd (a call that was from Floyd to Greg), LeMond says that Landis’ answer to his encouragement to come clean was, “What good would it do?” LeMond also went on to say that Landis said it would destroy a number of people around him for him to admit that. LeMond’s account of the conversation clearly paints a picture that Landis is guilty and covering up.
But that wasn’t all. LeMond also gave an account of a threatening phone call he claims to have received on his cell phone last night on his way to his hotel. The caller, LeMond says, claimed to be his uncle, and went on to mention that he would be at the hearing and that he was going to tell LeMond’s long held secret. LeMond gave his cell phone to one of USADA’s attorneys, who projected the phone and the number that the call originated from on the screen.
By LeMond’s telling of the story, the caller was Will Geoghegan. LeMond filed a police report for witness tampering, which was displayed on the overhead projector during the testimony. Whether it was Geoghegan or someone who stole Geoghegan’s number is not clear. But to hear LeMond’s telling, the call sent a chill down his spine.
[Apparently a Razr can show both incoming and outgoing calls, so I’m striking this next paragraph. Note: There’s something strange about this story, however. During the testimony, the phone number was projected from LeMond’s phone’s call records. Now I have the same service, and a Motorola phone (though not quite the same model), and my phone lists calls received and calls dialed in different displays. LeMond’s phone listed calls he said were both received (at 6:53 p.m.) and several that were dialed. LeMond’s phone appears to be one of the Razr variety. Anyone know if his phone could display both incoming and outgoing calls at the same time? ]
LeMond also spoke of Floyd’s posting about him on the Daily Peloton Forums and calling Landis to discuss the posting. (These are comments preserved at TBV, but lost when the Daily Peloton Forums crashed.) Following his reading of Landis’ post on the Internet forum, LeMond says looked up Landis’ phone number on the Internet (which cost him $15) and then he called and spoke with Landis.
Howard Jacobs started his cross examination, going through some routine questions. But he ran into a road-block when he began to ask questions regarding LeMond’s testimony in a 2005 lawsuit involving Lance Armstrong. Both USADA’s counsel and LeMond’s personal attorney objected to the line of questioning, but Jacobs said that it goes to LeMond’s motivation for testifying in the current case. After some discussion between the lawyers and the panel, Jacobs said that if he was not allowed to continue with his line of questioning, he would move to strike all of LeMond’s testimony.
Here’s something interesting that [edit]I found (and darned if I can find it again, it was a comment somewhere)[end edit]:
Anyone remember last year, when Greg Lemond claimed that Lance Armstrong called his home and threatened his wife’s life? He’s rather hard to believe, for me, at this point, after his erratic behavior for the last few years. Now he claims that more people are threatening him.
Perhaps this has something to do with Jacobs line of questioning.
As I’m writing this, the panel has taken a recess to consider Jacobs motion. More in a bit.
Update: After coming back, Jacobs started to resume questioning LeMond, but his attorney refused to allow his client to answer questions. They’ve now gone on to Dr. Christiane Ayotte’s testimony. I had to leave, and missed whether or not LeMond’s testimony would be struck, as Jacobs requested.
I cannot believe that if Floyd were guilty, he would subject himself to bankruptcy, his family to public shame, and all of his fans to solicitations for money to defend himself. It is one thing to dope, and those like Basso and Ullrich are reaping what they have sown for that by losing their careers, etc. It is entirely of another order to dope and then drag us all through the trenches to view every ugly detail before this is over — particularly his parents, who I know Floyd has a high respect for. That is why, despite LeMond and USADA and everyone else, I believe Floyd is telling the truth. No man in his right mind would subject himself and his family to this, if it weren’t for the highest purpose of defending his name. He would have taken the USADA deal and walked away quietly. But, oh, how ugly this has become.
This is F’d up… I’m going to ride my bike…which unfortunately has Greg’s name on it…
-James
James, when another rider passes your bike, does it begin to whine?
I work for a Wireless operator and have testified at a murder trials regarding wireless phone calls made/received. Regardless of what the mobile phone displays all incoming and outgoing calls records are kept for every account and can be requested for evidence in trials. They are similar to monthly bills but more detailed. The records have timestamps and show what antenna the calls were made on. Typcially the coverage range for an antenna is 1-2 miles max so they place a mobile phone (caller) within 1-2 miles.
As a first step in this case Floyd’s attorney should contact his business manager’s and LeMond’s mobile phone providers for all incoming and outgoing calls on both phones. The records will indicate where they both were approximately and what calls were made/received on both phones.
It is possible, the number was stolen or cloned but the antenna location data should show where the calls were made regardless.
A Motorola Razr is capable of displaying both the incoming and outgoing call log on the same screen.
As sad and disturbing as Mr. Lemonds testimony is, i fail to see it’s relevance in a case that will come down to science.
Paul, The records would also show call duration, right? I’m thinking that if Lemond is telling the truth the call should have been only a few seconds long. If the call lasted minutes then there it must have been much more to it.
In any case if Will G called Lemond it was a stupid thing to do. It just may not be what Lemond is saying it is.
Lemond is an disgrace to cycling. Period.
He’s jealous about Lance getting the limelight, so he went after him.. He didn’t like Lance saying “I’m not the next greg lemond, I’m the new Lance Armstrong” or whatever. Now he’s jealous of Floyd. He’s an idiot too. If indeed he did have such a horrible thing happen to him at a young age, that’s a private matter, or even if someone is leaving prank phone calls.. again.. who cares. Police matter maybe.. at best. Neither of those things have anything to do with the case..
So, lets say Lemond isn’t making this up. Number 1, why not just give the information about what Floyd said on the phone? Why Smear his own name with childhood sexual abuse? The sad story, poor, poor Lemond is just the same ol’ “look at ME!!” jargon that Lemond is throwing out.. and the fact that he won’t answer anything on the Armstrong questioning.. tell me that his story is very questionable. Why would he have anything to hide? Why be quiet? Because he knows that his credibility is crap.. or at least his Lawyer knows this.. 🙂
Even if Floyd doped, he wouldn’t be stupid enough to confess something like that to Lemond, after knowing how Lemond went after armstrong… hmmmmmm! ya know, I kinda remember reading how Lemond was supportive of Landis initially, I’m fairly sure this was after Floyd had called him. Then he changed his tune later after the synthetic. I think this is the story Lemond put out: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20060730134955AAd9whC after Landis has already spoken with him.. and he makes comments like: “if he is confirmed positive”.. hmm.. so apparently he didn’t know for “sure” then.. but during a trial.. sure.
Do a google news search on “Lemond”. As of 6:17PM CST, there are already 9 headlines, most of which are as grossly untrue as they are damaging to Landis. Here are a few samples: The Colorado Springs Gazette headline reads “Cyclist Greg LeMond: Landis told me he used drugs to win”. ABC7.com, CA runs “LeMond claims he was threatened not to testify”.
The tragedy of Floyd Landis has turned into farce. I have lost all respect for LeMond if he is afraid of testifying after being insulted on the phone. LeMond made the story public himself and anyone who threatened to “tell how he and his Uncle played hide the weenie” wouldn’t be breaking new ground. Nor are they threatening LeMond’s health or offering a bribe.
LeMond’s thin skin is shameful; it adds nothing to cycling, nothing to LeMond’s career and adds nothing to the Landis case. Rather, LeMond has succeeded in demeaning his sport, himself and our system of justice with tawdry stories and shameful self interest. Along the way, he may have made road kill out of Will Geohegan and, worse out of Floyd Landis. We are all fools if we let LeMond alter our opinion of Landis, the arbitration or USADA.
Ya, let’s talk about something else … about cell phones. I think Lemond’s phone looked more like a Blackberry, and at least my Razr V3 can NOT show both in- and outgoing calls on one screen (maybe the newer Razr’s can?).
Steve – I am speechless. Apoplectic at your attitude, but speechless. Exactly how has LeMond demeaned himself? By telling the truth? At great cost to his personal dignity, I might add!
The uncontested fact is that Landis’s manager and close personal friend, tried to intimidate LeMond into not testifying!!! Further, this is consistent with Floyd’s public statement (on the DPF discussion board) that he (Floyd) would disclose information that would “damage” LeMond if LeMond spoke publicly. In that statement, Floyd also used the despicable term “race to the bottom” as a description of what would happen. The inference is clear.
Contrary to your post, LeMond was not afraid of testifying – he bravely spoke the truth and, in doing so, publicly exposed an exceptionally painful and private matter about himself. LeMond is a brave man. Landis’s threats are the actions of a bully and a coward. And Will’s actions, in his paid capacity as Landis’s manager, are those of a complete slimeball.
You state that “we are fools if we let LeMond alter our opinion of Landis..” You are correct – but only if you already were of the opinion that Landis is a snivelling coward afraid to face the truth.
Muir, bravo!
Finally, someone makes sense.
IL, no the bike doesn’t whine…if it weren’t so pretty I’d yank the stickers off though.
I’ve been following this thing pretty closely since the beginning and now it’s making me sick. Conspiracy theory abounds, stupidity is everywhere…what in the hell is going on? Are we all going to start speculating that the ADA’s paid Will to make the call…or are we to assume that GL is lying about Will apologizing…WTF
Assuming Landis wins there is no way to recover from this now.
I hope the guys at TBV and Rant keep up the good work…Thanks
I also suggest that everyone get off the internet and go for a ride…it helps
Just a thought regarding Paul’s comments. If Will insists that he didn’t make the call…. How easy would it be for USADA/WADA to have someone that could get onto the phone number and place a call? Very, I’m thinking. If you had someone on the inside at the wireless company they could unassign Will’s number and reassign it to another phone, temporarily, then change it back. It would be easy to place oneself within the same tower triangulation. They know what Hotel Landis and his people are staying at, and they have remote access to their switch. I would hope that if this happened that the wireless companies switch records would prove this out, if they wanted to dig that deep.
If their ship is sinking… what wouldn’t they stoop to. Kind of breaks up the lab testimony, doesn’t it. Nice timing. Wasn’t Lemond scheduled to testify AFTER the lab folks today? Do we trust any of these guys not to do whatever it takes to WIN?
I hate to say it, everyone, but it’s sounding from various reports that I’ve seen like Will did make a very ill-advised phone call. What was said, I don’t know. But the damage from this to Team Landis is incalculable. I just don’t fathom why he would do such a thing.
Rant – I can see why you can’t fathom why he would do such a thing. Unfortunately, Will Geoghegan himself is already on record as to why:
QUOTE(Will)
“On that side of the line, they are all targets, with priorities and values assigned to each asset. When it serves a purpose, they will be targeted and a strike will be exacted. Ugly business…” (http://www.dailypelotonforums.com/main/ind…ost&p=39211)
Please, just face the facts. This was an entirely deliberate attempt to intimidate LeMond into not testifying.
Please, also remember that Landis had already specifically and very publicly threatened LeMond with disclosure of :
QUOTE (Floyd)
“…if he [LeMond] ever opens his mouth again and the word Floyd comes out, I will tell you all some things that you will wish you didn’t know…”
(http://www.dailypelotonforums.com/main/index.php?showtopic=2127&st=0&p=40444&#entry40444)
Whether you think Landis was directly a party to the latest intimidation attempt or not, you have to admit that this episode speaks volumes about the Landis camp. Right now, contrary to austin rider’s views (above), it appears that it is the Landis camp that is the “disgrace to cycling. Period” rather than LeMond.
In the rush to defend Landis, many of you seem to have lost all touch with reality.
Muir,
Thurday’s revelations make the Landis camp look pretty bad. That I’ll admit. Will stepped completely over the line by making that phone call. The collateral damage he caused may well take his (former?) friend down with him.
When Landis made the comment on DPF, it seemed to me like he was alluding to something other than what came out yesterday. Maybe I’m wrong, but it also seemed like he was hinting that LeMond isn’t quite so squeaky clean in the doping department. I don’t think any of us will ever truly know the contents of the phone call or calls between the two.
It’s a sad, sad day for the world of cycling, no matter which side of the fence you’re on regarding Landis and the accusations against him.
Sorry for the delay in your comment. I moved it out of moderation as soon as I found it.
– Rant
Here’s a thought: Perhaps a business manager did something stupid simply because he knows LeMond’s character and that he would try in every way possible to make himself look like the only good guy American to ever win the TdF. Greg Lemond is bitter about Armstrong, bitter about Landis and wanted to find a story and a way to vindicate some of the stupid ass comments he’s made over the years basically trying to keep himself in the limelight as the most important man in US cycling. Sorry but how in the hell can anyone believe anything that comes out of that man’s mouth? And who is stupid enough to think that anyone would say anything important or confidential to someone with his history of bullshit?
What’s really sad is to see what a tragic character of his own ego LeMond has become. His offences to cycling are far worse than anything I’ve seen in the sport. He has used the credibility associated with winning the Tour as a means to defend his lies, cover his own frail ego and destroy anything in his own way regardless of any real knowledge or truth.
The fact that he was sexually abused is probably the only complete truth in this story because that story goes a long way to explaining his massive character flaws and need for public praise and attention.
Greg LeMond is far too self-serving to be credible in any situation. He damaged his own credibility by making stupid statements without knowing anything and yesterday he saw an opportunity to feed his sad ego one more time.
Smile for the camera asshole!
Or maybe it wasn’t the real Will at all. Couldn’t Dick Pound and his cronies have kidnapped the genuine Will, programmed his brain waves into an imposter and sent that fake Will out to deliberately sabotage Floyd’s case by threatening Lemond. All they need to do now is to stage a fake traffic accident and swap the real Will back in, who will have unfortunately lost his memory for these last few days. After all they did it to Homer Simpson.
Muir: here is the definition of demean. Encarta offers “to reduce somebody to a much lower status is a humiliating way”. In my opinion, LeMond demeaned himself in many ways.
First, LeMond demeans himself by trying to substitute innuendo for admission. Landis admitted nothing to LeMond. He did not say “I doped”. He did make an indirect remark, asking “What good would that do?” Possibly Landis meant, “I didn’t dope, so, what good would admitting it be?” Nobody but Landis knows what motive the word “that” referred to. LeMond sullies himself by offering his opinion, obtusely construed for motive, in such a damaging way.
Second, LeMond demeans himself by bringing up such a sordid part of his past. Sexual abuse is awful, I agree. However, the Landis case has nothing to do with sexual abuse. LeMond demeans himself by offering a sensational and unrelated experience for private consumption by Landis and/or for public consumption his during arbitration.
Thirdly, LeMond demeans himself by his unsubstantiated persecution of cycling. LeMond speaks as a TDF champion. In that capacity, we ascribe both experience and insider knowledge to him. LeMond has made repeated remarks that Armstrong, Landis and, for that matter the peloton in general uses performance enhancing drugs (e.g., LeMond’s “house of cards” and “lies remarks made outside the courtroom yesterday). Yet, he offers no proof or any positive recommendation. LeMond demeans himself by using his accomplishments to tarnish the reputation of others. Worse, LeMond offers no direction and thereby demeans himself by being nothing but destructive.
Fourth, and most damning to me, LeMond demeans himself by being so disruptive. LeMond knows sport and media. He owns a business. We have a right to expect that LeMond understands the huge cost this case represents to Landis as well as the huge impact this case can have upon the world ADO. Yet, LeMond agrees to become a witness for USADA and offers no compelling facts about Landis. Worse, LeMond turns the arbitral proceeding into a soap opera with supposed concerns for his personal safety. I am disgusted by Geohgen’s call — it was immature and ill considered. For LeMond to suggest the call was a “threat” and “creepy” degrades his courage. More demeaning is LeMond’s willingness to focus the arbitration on himself based on such a trivial incident with the foreknowledge that it would distract the arbitrators and provide media fodder.
While I could go on about LeMond, let me take issue with your characterization of Landis as a “sniveling coward”. The thing that amuses me about your characterization is how aptly it describes LeMond. Go back and watch interviews of LeMond during his TDF years — especially 1984. See how LeMond “snivels” about Hinault’s promise to work for LeMond as opposed to race with him; see how LeMond complains that the peloton persecuted him and wouldn’t work with him because he they wanted Hinault to win. Those are remarks made by LeMond; they are part of the public record and are not disputable. I do not believe those remarks are not representative of a man with courage; they are remarks that are entirely consistent with LeMond’s performance yesterday — especially when, outside of the courtroom, LeMond said that “I think there’s another side of Floyd that the public hasn’t seen”. I would pay money to see LeMond say that to Landis in an alley with nothing but his fists to protect him. Then we would see who the sniveling coward truly was.
Steve, well said. You should have a blog somewhere…
The only questionable issue with respect to LeMond is why he was there in the first place. Even if Landis said what LeMond claims he said, it’s still little more than a vague implication that Landis is guilty. However, to criticize LeMond for testifing that he received a threatening phone call is ludicrous. Will’s clear intent was to intimidate a witness and his doing so colors Landis’ story with some very dark shades. Landis’ e-mail regarding LeMond, assuming his reference is to the sexual abuse, indicates that Landis believes LeMond is flawed somehow as a result of his being victimized. If this is so, then Landis needs an education. Will’s attempts at intimidation are so astoundingly stupid as to defy any logic. If only two or three beers on a Thursday night can cause him to do such things, imagine the fun he must be on New Year’s Eve. LeMond’s showing up for this thing may have been ill-advised or at least superfluous, but I think you guys who are characterizing him as a bad guy or ego-maniac or sniveling coward or whatever are as far off the mark as you would be off LeMond’s wheel on your best day. LeMond seems to be one of just a few people who are willing to throw themselves under the bus in the interest of cleaning up the sport.